HK

the place for sore tacos
It is currently Sun Jul 22, 2018 9:01 am

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 46 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 11:12 pm 
Offline
timid kitty
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 11:01 pm
Posts: 37
Location: San Diego
Anybody tried one of these or even heard of them?

http://absoluteblack.cc/oval-104bcd-chainring.html

Shimano had the Biopace years ago that never got much traction (pun intended), but according to these guys, Shimano got it backwards and put the "easy" part of the ellipse right in the power band, instead of the other way 'round.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 4:00 am 
Offline
friendly kitty

Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2013 11:38 pm
Posts: 326
Location: Indiana
I have one to put on after winter is over. Having a bad knee I am looking forward to see what it rides like.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 4:05 am 
Offline
pussy
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 5:23 am
Posts: 3969
I am afraid that if I installed one, I would start walking funny! :lol:

Let us know what it feels like.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 4:54 pm 
Offline
grumpeh kitty!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:47 pm
Posts: 340
I rode for many years on the Biopace rings (1988 Stumpjumper). I could feel a difference between that and my round-ring road bike, but I never had any knee or other issues.

The new oval design is intriguing -- there is a thread in the EB Singlespeed forum about whether or not they are "unfair" (for SSing). I don't give a rip about "fairness," but I'm monitoring that to get an idea of how well they perform in general. The climbs I have trouble with in San Diego are the short, steep grunts but everything else (90%) is doable. If an oval ring helps me overcome those struggles, I'd prefer to go that route rather than go up a tooth or 2 on the cog.

_________________
-- Frank --


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 12:23 am 
Offline
friendly kitty

Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2013 11:38 pm
Posts: 326
Location: Indiana
If I recall right, Absolute Black rings should be similar to the Rotor rings, though what I read didn't seem to say that outright. If they are the same as Rotor rings it should be decent. One of the top time trial guys used them in the TDF last year, and I can't see them using something that would not be something less than equal to a standard ring at that level of racing.

Once the snow is gone I will swap to the new chain ring, chain, and cassette.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 11:10 am 
Offline
bad kitty!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:22 am
Posts: 2611
Equal to standard rings yes, beneficial- well that remains to be proven beyond the usual marketing BS and religion.
From what I can tell it equals running a ring that is a tooth or so smaller.


Magura :)

_________________
DIY all the way


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 6:43 pm 
Offline
yappin' kitty

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:20 pm
Posts: 928
random walk wrote:
I rode for many years on the Biopace rings (1988 Stumpjumper). I could feel a difference between that and my round-ring road bike, but I never had any knee or other issues.

The new oval design is intriguing -- there is a thread in the EB Singlespeed forum about whether or not they are "unfair" (for SSing). I don't give a rip about "fairness," but I'm monitoring that to get an idea of how well they perform in general. The climbs I have trouble with in San Diego are the short, steep grunts but everything else (90%) is doable. If an oval ring helps me overcome those struggles, I'd prefer to go that route rather than go up a tooth or 2 on the cog.



I had a girl friend back then who got into mtb'ing and got a bike with the new Biopace chainrings. They did fuck her knees up pretty good.
Turned out she had/has a 'sub-clinicalcondition of 'chondromalacia' on her patellas, and the biopace just stirred that right up.
She stopped riding the biopace, got some acupuncture, and the 'clinical' became 'sub-clinical' again. No more problems.

_________________
'Merica's Finest City


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 6:53 pm 
Offline
yappin' kitty

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:20 pm
Posts: 928
Magura wrote:
Equal to standard rings yes, beneficial- well that remains to be proven beyond the usual marketing BS and religion.
From what I can tell it equals running a ring that is a tooth or so smaller.


Magura :)

So, does that mean these rings are better than round ones? I got a 1X10 that I could maybe jump up to a 34 from a 32 if that's the case, and I don't think chain retention would be a problem, as long as I can get the oval ring in narrow-wide. With that, and a clear polycarb bash guard I run on it, partly just because it looks 'cool', I don't think I will be losing a chain. It's also a X9 Type 2 setup.

Only thing is, I really NEED that 32X36 gear , more often than I like to think I do..

_________________
'Merica's Finest City


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 7:09 pm 
Offline
bad kitty!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:22 am
Posts: 2611
That would based on currently available evidence be a no.


Magura :)

_________________
DIY all the way


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 10:38 pm 
Offline
yappin' kitty

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:20 pm
Posts: 928
Magura wrote:
That would based on currently available evidence be a no.


Magura :)


I tend to be suspicious of the 'better mousetrap' stuff, especially with bicycles.

_________________
'Merica's Finest City


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 10:46 pm 
Offline
bad kitty!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:22 am
Posts: 2611
Well, Oval claims 10% power increase. That is obviously marketing BS, as 10% would send anybody not using them back in the dust by minutes.
So far the tests I've seen have been of less than scientific standard, which makes me tend to think that it's marketing BS.
If there really was such a gain, and if they had a patent that would stand trial, it would be unwise to not make scientific proof of the claim.


Magura :)

_________________
DIY all the way


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 11:04 pm 
Offline
yappin' kitty

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:20 pm
Posts: 928
Magura wrote:
Well, Oval claims 10% power increase. That is obviously marketing BS, as 10% would send anybody not using them back in the dust by minutes.
So far the tests I've seen have been of less than scientific standard, which makes me tend to think that it's marketing BS.
If there really was such a gain, and if they had a patent that would stand trial, it would be unwise to not make scientific proof of the claim.


Magura :)



All's I know is I really got dumped on over at EB on it's single speed forum for not joining the choir of true believers there.
That made me suspicious all by itself.

_________________
'Merica's Finest City


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 11:10 pm 
Offline
bad kitty!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:22 am
Posts: 2611
They were all over me at PB for the same reasons.

Magura :)

_________________
DIY all the way


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2015 2:46 am 
Offline
yappin' kitty

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:20 pm
Posts: 928
Magura wrote:
They were all over me at PB for the same reasons.

Magura :)



The difference to me is that I automatically suspect product-shills when this occurs at EB. I remember this one guy who made what turned out to be a fairly popular chain lube, but in the beginning it was slow. He advertised on EB, and then he actually told me that he had posted up several "user" reviews there under different names to boost the chili-rating of his product.
I don't think he even had to use different computers or anything. They just let him do it.

_________________
'Merica's Finest City


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2015 7:19 am 
Offline
timid kitty
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 11:01 pm
Posts: 37
Location: San Diego
Interesting thread over on EB in the SS forum - 27 pages so far! It was started by the AbsoluteBlack founder/designer/manufacturer so it's technically unpaid advertising. I'm surprised the mods haven't gotten their panties in a bunch but maybe they haven't noticed (or just don't care?).

The logic and physics sound convincing and some first-hand accounts were starting to come in (I gave up reading after about 10 pages) sounding mostly positive. I'm 90% convinced at this point to go drink some of that Cool Aid. I'm running 1x10 with a 32t Race Face NW driving an 11-36 cassette, which I'm mostly happy with but I could use a little lower gearing on the low end. A 32t oval AB ring claims to give an effective low-end equivalent to a 30t which might be all I need. The alternative would be a 40t or 42t cassette conversion (Wolftooth or OneUp) but I'm not sure I want to space out my ratios like that - plus it's cheaper :)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2015 9:50 am 
Offline
bad kitty!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:22 am
Posts: 2611
The Wolftooth ring are proven and working as advertised.

Magura :)

_________________
DIY all the way


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2015 8:21 pm 
Offline
yappin' kitty

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:20 pm
Posts: 928
chuckanado wrote:
Interesting thread over on EB in the SS forum - 27 pages so far! It was started by the AbsoluteBlack founder/designer/manufacturer so it's technically unpaid advertising. I'm surprised the mods haven't gotten their panties in a bunch but maybe they haven't noticed (or just don't care?).

The logic and physics sound convincing and some first-hand accounts were starting to come in (I gave up reading after about 10 pages) sounding mostly positive. I'm 90% convinced at this point to go drink some of that Cool Aid. I'm running 1x10 with a 32t Race Face NW driving an 11-36 cassette, which I'm mostly happy with but I could use a little lower gearing on the low end. A 32t oval AB ring claims to give an effective low-end equivalent to a 30t which might be all I need. The alternative would be a 40t or 42t cassette conversion (Wolftooth or OneUp) but I'm not sure I want to space out my ratios like that - plus it's cheaper :)



Maybe they have received a bit of the old, under-the-table-swag? Or maybe even a bit more, eh?
That's the EB-Way.

_________________
'Merica's Finest City


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2015 8:24 pm 
Offline
yappin' kitty

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:20 pm
Posts: 928
Magura wrote:
The Wolftooth ring are proven and working as advertised.

Magura :)


The Wolftooth 32 T ring I have on my 1X10 drivetrain, with a type X9 der., has not dropped once, and the frame it's on is a 7" travel single pivot.
I'm liking it.

_________________
'Merica's Finest City


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2015 8:36 pm 
Offline
yappin' kitty
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2013 10:27 pm
Posts: 506
Location: NoVA
Since the oval ring thread was put into the SS forum, I posted once. Yes, he's promoting his own product freely. Whether or not it equals 2 teeth in more power sounds like pure mktg magic.

My dislike for an oval SS ring is that it will have tight spots, and will wear more quickly. Running any Alu ring w/o a bash has not gone well for me, so I'm a big fan of Salsa SS rings.

...sent by dixie cup/string


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2015 11:57 pm 
Offline
friendly kitty

Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2013 11:38 pm
Posts: 326
Location: Indiana
I bought one, but doubt the 10% power increase. I do want it to have the easier spot where my knee has a weak spot in the push. If that does not hold true, the Woolftooth is going back on and I will give an honest review of the oval ring's good, bad, and doesn't happen points.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 2:09 am 
Offline
yappin' kitty
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:05 pm
Posts: 957
Location: Dallas, TX
I also bought an Absolute black 32t oval ring. Looking forward to it. I'll let y'all know if I am 10% faster. I'll be using it on my SS 32x17.


Sent from my hammock

_________________
Nothing to see here


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 2:56 am 
Offline
timid kitty
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 11:01 pm
Posts: 37
Location: San Diego
I just put in my order for the 32t oval ring last night. Let's see how long it takes to get here. They were originally shipping from the UK (late last year), but by now they may have set up a distribution point over on this side of the pond.

I'm currently running a bashwich on my original triple crank (Stylo GXP) with my RaceFace nw ring occupying the old middle-ring position (inboard side of the spider). Outer bash is outboard of the spider (old big-ring position) and the 64bcd inner bash is mounted in place of the old granny ring. But, the new 32t oval will have a built-in 2mm offset so it may screw up the clearance with my inner bash. Maybe with the NW tooth profile and my X9 type-2 RD, I don't really need the security of the bashwich (plus I run a bionicon C-guide - overkill?)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Tue Mar 03, 2015 3:01 am 
Offline
timid kitty
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 11:01 pm
Posts: 37
Location: San Diego
Another thing I just thought about - it might look kinda strange having a round bash guard trying to cover an oval chainring. The large-diameter parts will stick out beyond the bash, and the small-diameter parts will be recessed. Too bad, I dig the look of the bashwich but maybe it's time for it to go. I also wish the AB rings came in red anodized. The choice was black ano or Cannondale Green so I went with the black.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 1:55 am 
Offline
yappin' kitty
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:05 pm
Posts: 957
Location: Dallas, TX
I think that's a tad bit overkill on the chain retention. Just the derailleur and NW ring should be sufficient. I can understand the bash with an expensive ring but bash which and a chain guide? What kind of riding?


Sent from my hammock

_________________
Nothing to see here


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:17 am 
Offline
timid kitty
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 11:01 pm
Posts: 37
Location: San Diego
Paul_C wrote:
I think that's a tad bit overkill on the chain retention. Just the derailleur and NW ring should be sufficient. I can understand the bash with an expensive ring but bash which and a chain guide? What kind of riding?


Sent from my hammock

I'm sure you're right about it being overkill. Lately I mostly ride rolling XC stuff but I do like the occasional rock garden, fast rocky descent, etc. I'm not a big air guy by any stretch but I'll always hit drops up to 2 or 3 feet. I'm on a Haro Xeon, which is a 26" AM-ish rig with 160mm rear travel and a Fox Float 140 up front.

I think I just kept adding stuff and tweaking what I had to get where it is now - in it's original 3x9 form (and later as a 2x9), I regularly dropped chains and it was a real pain because the chain would get wedged between the granny ring and a suspension pivot bearing that was right there. I can't tell you how many times I had to loosen the crank to get the chain loose (which is why I always carry a full length 8mm allen wrench). When I went to 1x9 I used an n-gear Jump-Stop which helped a lot but sometimes the chain would get past it too (and, in fact, get wedged under it). I finally decided to go with the bash-wich (using BBG bashguards), which was... a bit risky because due to a big clearance issue I had to grind a hefty chunk of aluminum out of my chainstay :shock: But then I noticed a lot of chainslap going down those fast rocky descents (Old Ray and Random Walk: think descending Indian Creek or Fern Flat); this was made more noticeable because the inner bashguard is fairly thin aluminum, so when the chain slapped against it I'd hear PING, PING, PING! When I saw someone on the interwebz singing the praises of the C-guide, I decided that was for me (its greatest strength is in stopping chainslap - and I can't use any of the more conventional chainguides as my Haro's suspension design puts a big 'ol pivot bearing around the outside of my BB shell, with no ISCG tabs, etc.). At that point I had everything pretty dialed in when I smashed* my rear (only) shifter (x7 or x9, can't remember) so rather than spend good money on old tech to replace it, I found a deal on a gently-used 10-speed shifter/derailleur/chain/cassette (x9 type-2 derailleur) on Craigslist. Plus that got me to a 36t granny cog to replace my old 9-spd 11-34 cassette.

When the AB oval ring arrives I'll probably ditch the bashwich and maybe the c-guide and see how things go.

* for the San Diego peeps, that was on a slow-speed OTB making the turn onto Stairway to Hell (near the bottom of Noble Canyon)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:53 am 
Offline
yappin' kitty
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:05 pm
Posts: 957
Location: Dallas, TX
I ride a SS so my posts are much shorter. ;)


Sent from my hammock

_________________
Nothing to see here


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 1:16 pm 
Offline
bad kitty!
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:22 am
Posts: 2611
If you're a clown on two wheels like me, a bash is a bare minimum to make it back home without walking.

Magura :)

_________________
DIY all the way


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Thu Mar 05, 2015 5:12 pm 
Offline
yappin' kitty

Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:20 pm
Posts: 928
chuckanado wrote:
Paul_C wrote:
I think that's a tad bit overkill on the chain retention. Just the derailleur and NW ring should be sufficient. I can understand the bash with an expensive ring but bash which and a chain guide? What kind of riding?


Sent from my hammock

I'm sure you're right about it being overkill. Lately I mostly ride rolling XC stuff but I do like the occasional rock garden, fast rocky descent, etc. I'm not a big air guy by any stretch but I'll always hit drops up to 2 or 3 feet. I'm on a Haro Xeon, which is a 26" AM-ish rig with 160mm rear travel and a Fox Float 140 up front.

I think I just kept adding stuff and tweaking what I had to get where it is now - in it's original 3x9 form (and later as a 2x9), I regularly dropped chains and it was a real pain because the chain would get wedged between the granny ring and a suspension pivot bearing that was right there. I can't tell you how many times I had to loosen the crank to get the chain loose (which is why I always carry a full length 8mm allen wrench). When I went to 1x9 I used an n-gear Jump-Stop which helped a lot but sometimes the chain would get past it too (and, in fact, get wedged under it). I finally decided to go with the bash-wich (using BBG bashguards), which was... a bit risky because due to a big clearance issue I had to grind a hefty chunk of aluminum out of my chainstay :shock: But then I noticed a lot of chainslap going down those fast rocky descents (Old Ray and Random Walk: think descending Indian Creek or Fern Flat); this was made more noticeable because the inner bashguard is fairly thin aluminum, so when the chain slapped against it I'd hear PING, PING, PING! When I saw someone on the interwebz singing the praises of the C-guide, I decided that was for me (its greatest strength is in stopping chainslap - and I can't use any of the more conventional chainguides as my Haro's suspension design puts a big 'ol pivot bearing around the outside of my BB shell, with no ISCG tabs, etc.). At that point I had everything pretty dialed in when I smashed* my rear (only) shifter (x7 or x9, can't remember) so rather than spend good money on old tech to replace it, I found a deal on a gently-used 10-speed shifter/derailleur/chain/cassette (x9 type-2 derailleur) on Craigslist. Plus that got me to a 36t granny cog to replace my old 9-spd 11-34 cassette.

When the AB oval ring arrives I'll probably ditch the bashwich and maybe the c-guide and see how things go.

* for the San Diego peeps, that was on a slow-speed OTB making the turn onto Stairway to Hell (near the bottom of Noble Canyon)



That's a great place to crash! Nice and isolated!

My Ellsworth Joker is similar to your Haro, I think. It's an '05 frame, a single pivot, 180mm travel.
I recently converted it to a SRAM 1X10 X9 type-2 drivetrain, with a Wolftooth ring up front. My friend had a polycarb bash-guard laying around his shop, so I tossed it on mostly for looks.

Anyways, I haven't thrown a chain on that setup yet. It's pretty good, I think....

_________________
'Merica's Finest City


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2015 10:09 pm 
Offline
timid kitty
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2015 11:01 pm
Posts: 37
Location: San Diego
Something came in the mail today, all the way from Poland...

Image

Image

Image

Image

I hope to find the time to get it on the bike and go for a test ride this weekend :)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Oval chainrings
PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 2:46 pm 
Offline
yappin' kitty
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 25, 2013 9:05 pm
Posts: 957
Location: Dallas, TX
Me too!!!
Attachment:
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1426862794.196121.jpg
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1426862794.196121.jpg [ 368.86 KiB | Viewed 7583 times ]



Sent from my hammock

_________________
Nothing to see here


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 46 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Theme created StylerBB.net